Annealing

[ryutzy]

I've recently started annealing my brass. I've read numerous articles and different ways of annealing. One article on Accurateshooter.com that I read really warned against over annealing. I'd love to see some pics of your annealed brass. How dark is the color after you are done? The brass that I've annealed turned a dark gold color with some bluish colors appearing. I felt according to the articles I've read that this is about right. I compared it to my Lapua brass which comes annealed and the Lapua has a much darker color down through the shoulder. If l keep my necks in the torch long enough to get that dark color, I think I would be over annealing the brass according to the article in accurateshooter. I keep my brass in the end of the blue flame of the torch for 8-9 seconds then dip in water to cool. I put the brass in a drill chuck to turn the brass in the flame. I know some use a dark room to see a faint red glow of the brass appear and then dip in water. I've also heard that if you see slight red then you have over annealed the necks and they may be too soft for best accuracy. So what are your experiences???? I'd like to see some pics.

[Fred_C_Dobbs]

The problem with using color as a gauge is that it's completely subjective. You can spend good money ruining brass, annealing by trial and error until you get it right, or you can spend good money buying some Tempilaq and know how hot you're getting it.

[wirelessguy2005]

The Tempilaq never lies. I wouldn't worry to much about the color of the brass. different brands of brass are going to look different after annealing. As long as you use tempilaq to tell you when you reach the correct temp you will be good to go.

[ryutzy]

ok I was trying to be cheap and not buy it but that could end up being more expensive. I'm ordering some. I'm assuming from what I've read the 650 degree stuff is the way to go? Is there any cleanup after using this product? Does it evaporate and go away or will I have to clean it up?

[Rick in Oregon]

Once you use Tempilaq, you'll have the "feel" for brass temp, and you won't need it for every case, just starting out.

I've been annealing brass now for about 18 years using TK's Series II Annealing Tip, and so far, have not lost a single case to split neck or shoulder, or for any annealing-related issue.....ever, and I've not painted a case with any temp sticks for many years, now having the right feel for how long to keep the flame on the shoulder/neck junction.

It's using muscle memory to gauge the temp AFTER you've experimented with the temp stick...you just don't need it for every case you intend to anneal, unless you just want to take as much time as possible to anneal your cases.

Some freshly formed, neck turned and annealed 20VT's in my CRT bench tray during a hot squirrel shoot here last season:



Annealing is not magic, nor is it difficult to do. Just don't over heat your cases, and use a temp stick until you're comfortable with the process. If you shoot a wildcat caliber, form cases from a parent case, or want your brass to last a very long time, it's something worth mastering.

[bow shot]

Agreed on the tempilaq. Cheap, accurate and effective. Triple play, you can't ask for more.

As the brethren have said, you'll find that once you get in the groove, you get the feel of it and won't need the 'laq.

[bow shot]

Just a note: I happened to notice that my unpolished brass changed color right on the nail in agreement with the tempilaq. Using polished brass, I could not see a (brass) color change at all.

'Not saying the brass color chage should be used as the indicator. Just saying mine happened to coincide nicely. Gotta start with the tempilaq and go from there.

[ryutzy]

Ok so here's where I'm at now. I got 650 degree Tempilaq. The Tempilaq never really liquifies, just turns to a black crisp in 4 seconds. I put some on the inside of the neck and the outside as well and they both turn black and crisp the same time. I am using a propane torch and I'm a little surprised how fast the tempilaq gets burnt. I am now annealing for about 5 seconds then dunking brass in water. I'm hoping that my brass that I did earlier is still ok as I had it in the flame about 8 seconds.

[ryutzy]

Ok so I took a piece of brass and intentionally ruined it. And just for my own reference I decided to do it in a dark room. The brass began to get a dull red glow at the 10-12 second mark. This is when I stopped and decided to do the squeeze test I've read about. I let the brass cool then I took a needlenose pliers and wrapped a cloth around the brass neck and gave it a slow squeeze. The brass was soft and had no spring to it at all. Obviously ruined. I then took a new (virgin) case (not annealed) and did the same thing carefully watching the case mouth. As soon as I saw the mouth slightly deform I'd stop and you could see the brass slightly spring back. Interesting.....so in my case with my setup and brass....RED GLOW = BAD

[bow shot]

Ryutzy, Are you using the stick or the liquid?

If you are using the stick (like me) it is a bit of a PITA, it may take you wrecking 3-4 cases to understand that: "it takes __ seconds, rotating at __ speed, __ inches form the flame, for the tempilaq to change colors"

My set up is 28 seconds, in the flame of my stove, rotating in my cordless, any speed, sitting in a ratchet socket.

The bad thing about the stick is that it isn't meant for smooth surfaces, so you have to get creative about getting it "on" the case. The good thing is that, as I recall, according to the instructions, you are just waiting for it to melt, not change colors. The stick isn't like the bottled stuff...

I'll see if I can find that for you.

[ryutzy]

I am using a propane torch and liquid Tempilaq. The 650 degree Temilaq turns to a black crisp in about 4 seconds. It started to change color slightly then just instantly turns to a black crisp. I'm guessing that my torch flame is hotter than your stove flame? It seems like my brass should be hot enough between the 5-7 second mark to be properely annealed.
I was kinda disappointed in the Tempilaq really, I figured it should turn to a liquid first, but it skipped the liquid part and went black. I also put some inside the neck with the same results. If I was better with the computer, I'd video it and post it.

[bow shot]

hmmm... that sounds kinda odd. Are you using a propane torch? I'm thinking that if you are using oxy/acetelene or MAP that may explain the super rapid heating?

[BillC]

For rifle brass, I use a Lee lead pot to anneal.
I plug the pot in and let the lead go molten, checking the temperature with an infrared thermometer (point and shoot from Harbor Freight), using the temp controller to bring it up to 850 degrees F. Once the lead is up to temp, I grab a case by the head in my bare hand, dip the case mouth/shoulder in light oil (3 in 1) to prevent the lead from sticking, then put the neck and shoulder in the lead. By using my bare fingers, there is no chance that I will overheat the case head. Once it gets uncomfortably hot in my hand, I drop the brass in a bucket of water with some simple green added and go to the next case. The simple green removes the oil and the water prevents the case head from heat soaking.
Once the cases are all finished, I agitate the bucket a little and rinse well then drain and let them dry, followed by a trip through the tumbler.

I've been using this method for years and it has worked flawlessly for me.

Bill.