Need info primers backing out!

[Frank]

jo, I understand what you are saying. Also, neck sizing will definitely add much life to brass. But that's it. It will NOT give any more accuracy. Why else do the very top benchrest shooters F/L size? That has also been my own personal experience with neck sizing. Proper Headspacing is another issue and of course can increase accuracy. Just not that much in a hunting rifle. I have way too many one hole targets to support this.

Also, F/L size brass can in fact last many rounds of reloading. Depending on caliber! I especially agree that brass must always be measured and trimmed after each firing. I guess we are just gonna have to agree to disagree on this one.

Bayou, you shouldn't flatter YOURSELF. No Honest! YOU really shouldn't!

I'm done

[jo191145]

Frank
I FL size everything now. I just make sure my dies are properly set for the headspace of my rifle.
Properly done a bushing FL die will give the same number of reloads as a bushing neck die without the need to switch back and forth. Now thats simply my opinion

I necksized for years cause that was the fad. Even converted my neck dies to shoulder bump dies. Nowadays I just use a FL die or body die / neck combo depending on cartridge.

[Bayou City Boy]

Keep taking the meds, Frank.... They'll kick in one of these days and then you'll feel better.

And keep reading jo111945's great posts about cartridge head space. It's obvious you'll learn a few things... Pretty soon some of those one hole groups you're keeping in your sock drawer will be half hole groups...

-BCB

[giterdone]

For info only......Most of the time I use a Redding "Competition Bushing Neck sizing die" because I dont want to use a die that pulls an "expander" thru the neck to bring it back to size. I also use a Forster "Bushing-Bump die" if I need to bring the headspace back where it belongs. This die "does not" size the body like a full length die does. I prefer NOT to squeeze the body of the case back to factory size and perhaps change the O.A.L of the brass case that then may result in unnecessary trimming ; where as I use the "Bushing-Bump Die" to headspace (shoulder only) and the proper size bushing I choose to size the neck down. I see no need to full length size. If you are pushing the envelope (pressure wise), your brass may at some point need to be full length sized. What it boils down to is..... sort thru what others are doing and decide which direction to go. Be happy, dont argue and Keep em Centered.

[jo191145]

giterdone

Also just for info and I'm about as happy as I ever get
Lately I've been useing a Redding FL die with bushing. S series if memory serves.
In round robin tests between FL sized and shoulder bumped neck sized (same bushing and brass) I got better accuracy using the FL die. I stuck with it (subject to change without notice )

In my expierience a properly headspaced FL die will actually reduce trimming requirements. Necksized brass has no choice but to flow forward (longer OAL) FL sized brass has the ability to expend some of that energy refilling the chamber.
The key to this is NOT returning the brass to "factory specs". Screw that die down to the instructions and brass will definately grow long real fast. You'll be stretching the web area and severely shortening the life of the brass.

Now my FL test may be just applicable for that particular load in that particular chamber/barrel.
Its quite possible a different powder in a different tube or even the same tube might prefer necksized brass instead. Don't ask me for any particulars on that. Only God knows and he's remaining silent on the subject.

I see we missed a question by Ryan a ways back. No a primer alone will not expand your brass back to the chamber dimensions.

[giterdone]

jo191145 said....Lately I've been using a Redding FL die with bushing. S series if memory serves.
In round robin tests between FL sized and shoulder bumped neck sized (same bushing and brass) I got better accuracy using the FL die.

jo...Your input is appreciated. I dont believe that Redding sells a "shoulder-bump bushing" neck die, but that Forster does offer one (without sizing the body). If Redding had one I would have bought it. Redding does have a body sizing die that does not size the neck but can bump the shoulder (no decapping provision). Your type "S" FL bushing die uses a standard expander ball. If you are having good results with your choice of dies thats a good thing. I also like the idea of using a bushing to size my case necks; I dont quite understand the reasoning behind pulling an expander button thru a bushing sized neck. Unless you are shooting them in a semi-auto and want more neck tension (using a smaller bushing) on the bullet to prevent bullet movement back into case due to recoil. You are going to partially size the body of the brass case using a FL die; how much or how little depends upon how far down you seat the die. This causes the brass to flow forward and lengthen the case as it comes from the die. You didn't mention if you were shooting a bolt gun or a semi-auto. I shoot a Savage 12VLP in .204 Ruger.

[jo191145]

Yes as far as I know Redding does not make a shoulder bump die. Anyone who understands headspace and takes the time to measure it can make their own shoulder bump neck die out of any brand neck sizer. Its very easy and mine is a Redding S series neck sizer. Made one for the 6 BR too. Eventually I'll make one for the 6ppc just haven't gotten around to it yet.

As for the S series FL die all S series come with both an expander ball or decapper pin retaining nut. If anyone does'nt get a decapper pin retaining nut call Redding and they'll send it right out.

I have nothing against neck sizing, shoulder bump necksizing or FL sizing (done correctly)

I think FL sizing has got a bad rep over the years from people not understanding the importance of doing it right. The generic one size fits all directions that come with most FL dies does not help.
As Frank pointed out a good proportion of competitors body size thier brass to some extent nowadays. Sure their dies and chambers are usually always a closer fit than what we get on a factory rifle/factory die combo.
All the more reason to measure headspace correctly for anyone using a FL die in a factory rifle.
Use whatever you prefer or proves to work better folks. Its that simple.

[giterdone]

jo191145.... Hope to meet or shoot with you someday. I have been reloading for many years and im still learning. Used to shoot long range 800,900 and 1,000 yards using crossed-sticks with Black Powder Cartridge Rifles (BPCR) (peep sights) until eyes started giving me trouble. ....Keep em Centered

[jo191145]

giterdone

I'm never adverse to meeting shooters Can't find a better class of people anywhere.
BPCR. Now thats very interesting!!! Never knew such a thing existed so I googled it. Now that sounds like fun. Unfourtunately I doubt my eyes are up to the task also. Always liked peep sights as a kid but nowadays I have a hard enough time using mega power scopes
I have an old 45-70 Rolling Block. (my fathers actually but he shares well) Bought a few boxes of ammo for it when I was a kid and did some plinkin. Fun gun and sure did a number on squash and watermelon in my moms garden. Its been thirty years or more but I think she's forgiven me now.

Might have to pull that ol bad boy out and give it a try again
A Nightforce on a Rolling Block. Interesting, very interesting