Question regarding free bore

[goosebrown]

Hey all. Haven't been here in ages. I have a question.

I have an R700 varmint. I was handloading and not getting good results. I have to use un-leaded only. I got advice here and from Redding that copper bullets like to jump to the lands and Redding recommended going to the minimum suggested load and then seat 2/100ths off the lands or more then check for pressure and increase loads till I was where I wanted to be.

Fine I thought.

I bought a Hornady Lock-N-Load Overall Length Gage Bolt Action and it was spot on for my .308. I just got the .204 modified case and ran through the procedure and the freebore is so long, the bullet pops right out of the case, the plunger, if you are familiar with the tool, is about .5mm from the case mouth and there is literally no more neck to seat bullet into.

1. How long should the freebore be?
2. With copper, how far back from the lands to you want the bearing point? I have a comparitor to check.
3. Would 24/100ths be too far off the lands if you see no signs of pressure on the fired cases?

I have shot factory ammo and that is not even close to the bearing point either.

4. Does Remington suck?

OK... don't answer #4...

Should I be pricing out new barrels?

[Joe O]

Seems all the factory chambers have excessive freebore in 204ruger,regardless of manufacturer.However the bullet does shoot well with this setup.Most factory loads are 2.250 +/-, with a heavy crimp.I load to a 2.350 COAL.I like the base of the bullet to be at or just above the neck/shoulder junction.Yeah,I used a Sinclair OAL gage and thought I was doing something wrong.I couldn't believe the freebore either.

[goosebrown]

Thank you! I thought I was crazy. I looked down the bore to see if something was stuck in the front of the chamber... I just couldn't believe it.

OK. Back to developing a load. Going to try RL10x. Was using H4895 and not loving the results.

[GaCop]

Hey all. Haven't been here in ages. I have a question.

I have an R700 varmint. I was handloading and not getting good results. I have to use un-leaded only. I got advice here and from Redding that copper bullets like to jump to the lands and Redding recommended going to the minimum suggested load and then seat 2/100ths off the lands or more then check for pressure and increase loads till I was where I wanted to be.

Fine I thought.

I bought a Hornady Lock-N-Load Overall Length Gage Bolt Action and it was spot on for my .308. I just got the .204 modified case and ran through the procedure and the freebore is so long, the bullet pops right out of the case, the plunger, if you are familiar with the tool, is about .5mm from the case mouth and there is literally no more neck to seat bullet into.

1. How long should the freebore be?
2. With copper, how far back from the lands to you want the bearing point? I have a comparitor to check.
3. Would 24/100ths be too far off the lands if you see no signs of pressure on the fired cases?

I have shot factory ammo and that is not even close to the bearing point either.

4. Does Remington suck?

OK... don't answer #4...

Should I be pricing out new barrels?

Not to hijack your thread but, where did you find the 204 modified case for the Hornady OAL tool? I' ordered one directly from Hornady six weeks ago and still haven't gotten it. They told me it would be later in June before they had any? I sent them an e-mail early AM yesterday asking if they were finally shippng the modified 204's and so far, have been ignored.

[Tokimini]

I have a R700 SPS and my most accurate loads have been with an OAL of 2.313".

[Rick in Oregon]

Not to hijack your thread but, where did you find the 204 modified case for the Hornady OAL tool?

Most places that sell these supplies usually have a 204 Modified Case on the shelf with the other calibers. The Nosler Pro Shop usually has them in stock most of the time, as does Sportsmans Warehouse.

OR........use a 5/16"-36 tap with "I" letter size tap drill and chuck it up in the lathe and make it yourself. Most of mine were made that way, just use a fired case and a Univesal Decapper and you're set.

[stein]

+1 Rick in Oregon. I will not pay the $6.00 for a modified case.

[btlbrn]

Got mine at Bass Pro. There certainly is a lot of freebore. I just started with one caliber (at least) in the neck and went from there.

[GaCop]

In desperation, I took a new case and cut two slits in the case neck to use as an oal gauge. It worked when I was loading for my AR,at least I knew the max to the lands OAL for each bullet I was loading.

[goosebrown]

Well I still am having no luck. With the case gauge I got the shell at Midaway I believe... Anyway, the bullet goes so far into the leade that it falls out of the case before it hits the rifling. I called Remington on it and they said to return it. If they can't find a problem I am going to rebarrel it. I really thought about rebarreling to 22-250 but will probably stick with 204. So far though my 204 journey has not been a success at all.

I know I can shoot because I can shoot 1/2" or smaller all day long with any of 3 308s I have access to. This R700 just doesn't shoot and the leade is the last thing I can think of chasing down.

Anyone like PacNor barrels BTW?

[Rick in Oregon]

goose: You have not been paying attention. Had you been, you'd know by now that the 204 Ruger was designed with a tremendous amount of FREEBORE. This freebore was designed into the cartridge to reach the manufacturers wish to exceed 4,200 fps with factory ammunition with the associated claim to speed fame. With a two-fold combination of special non-canister powder (Primex SMP746) AND this excessive freebore, this high velocity was possible.

You'll never be able to reach the lands with most factory barrels in 204 Ruger....just ain't gonna happen, so don't fret about it. Most of these rifles shoot well with as much as .100" jump to the rifling, you just need to find the component combination your rifle likes and work with it.

I built a custom 204 on a M700 action using an 11 twist Pac-Nor SS Super Match barrel using a reamer I designed myself, having only .015" of freebore, and a .230" neck, which essentially gives me a "no-turn" neck, meaning that factory brass is nice 'n snug in my chamber without outside neck turning (.001" clearence/side), and my bullets can be seated to touch the lands if wanted. The gun shoots the 39 SBK and any of the 40's quite well indeed, usually giving 100 yard five shot groups in the .1's or .2's. But the caveat is that a chamber thus set up should not be used with factory ammunition; no problem for me, as none of my rifles has ever seen a factory round.

Yes, I like Pac-Nor.....there's more than one of them in my safe.

Oh, by the way, if you decide to rechamber to 22-250 (DON'T! That will be a step backwards), you'll need either a different rifle or a new bolt from Remington, as the 22-250 uses a larger bolt face than the 223-204 family of cartridges.

[RAMOS]

Now I'm totally confused. I thought FREE BORE was a male wild pig but, the measurements you guys are throwing out here are pretty small! Sorry, I will mind my own business now....

[Rick in Oregon]

Ramos: OR.....it could be the family free bore you get at holidays that comes for free, and bores the heck out of the entire family while he's/she's there......

Seriously though, if you own a factory 204 Ruger rifle, you also own alot of freebore, like it or not. Roy Weatherby got rich and famous by his judicious use of this very freebore thingie to get the speed he was seeking in his line of propriatary hunting cartridges. It's just something that anybody handloading for the 204R needs to be aware of, as these rifles are not chambered as is the norm for most varmint/target cartridges.

[204Shooter]

Just an FYI:

I am working with a barrel manufacture to get some .204 AR barrels. The barrel that I just tested did not return good results; lower than normal pressure and velocity and I was not impressed with accuracy. The cause? Don't know for sure yet but the reamer manufacture has seen similar results before when using the SAAMI specs with WAY TOO MUCH free-bore. According to him, cutting the free-bore in half fixed the problem with velocity, pressure and accuracy. I should be getting another barrel to test in the next couple of weeks. I will let you know how it goes.

[goosebrown]

OK then. Advice good. I have some sierra 39gr coming and some new powders, (H4895 has been best of the bunch and still have that, 2015, 2520 and 10x are coming. I have not had luck with Varget or Benchmark) I will do some development and see what I see.

If anyone has an R700 with a load that works well can you share that with me as a starting point?