SmallCaliberCentral

alright,here is my situation
savage mdl 25 204ruger
1-12 twist
hornady brass
wsrp
h4895 27.3gr
40 gr V-max
3815 fps
third time NECK SIZED
I have shot this load for at least a hundred rounds or a bit more,and have had no issues,extremely good accuracy.Just this week I noticed a fired round with a primer that looked a lil different,apon further investigation I thought I would check out the rest of the remaining fired rounds from this batch of reloads and I noticed 3 out of 13 fired rounds have pierced primers.now one note that might be important is,that this batch was neck sized only and I beleieve it was the second time neck sized.I use the lee collet neck sizer.when I chambered my neck sized brass before powder charging and bullet seating,I noticed the odd one was a lil tight to chamber,some were to tight,so I put them in the flrs die.Is it possibble that my tight rounds are not chambering all the way due to stretched shoulder there for minimizing the space for the firing pin to fully extend there for piercing my primers.I am not gonna shoot this batch anymore and am gonna try my flrs rounds of the same load and see what primers will llook like then,,the load is below the hogdon max level,and if I do get pierced primer then I will shoot some factory 40gr v-max and see what happens,and if I get pierced primers then obviously it's a firing pin issue and I will need to go see my gunsmith.
ANY INPUT would be greatly appreciated..thank's in advance.
P.S. I love this gun and caliber..makes hamburger out of those pesky skunks here in southern ontario

You didn't indicate the brand of primer. Some have a softer cup than others. Also your loads worked up in cooler weather, even with H4895 might be just enough increase with this warm weather we are having now to pierce them. 3,815 is pretty hot with a 40 vm in my rifle. In fact I only get about 3,700 fps from 27.3g of H4895 with a 22"barrel.

wsrp =winchester small rifle primer
load was worked up in the summer and I'm shooting in the summer
my muzzle velocity is out of a 24'' barrel

i would give the Remington 7 1/2 BR a try. I bet your problems will disappear.

Not likely the firing pin unless it has burned the tip when the primers pierced. Usually I can go 4 firings before having to bump the shoulder with a Redding body die, but every rifle is different. Some shooters believe the WSR primers with the brass colored cups are much softer and can be pierced much easier than the older silver cups.

Check the firing pin with a magnifying glass to be sure about the tip. I'd change primers to a Rem 7.5 BR and see if they still pierce since they are known to have a harder cup. I'm assuming you're still shooting from the original powder source, and haven't opened a new can.

I am using the same lot of powder,,checking the firing pin sounds like a good idea,except I don't know how to do that,,if the piercing persist,,I will try different primer,or factory ammo to see if piercing persist.and if so,I guess I will visit my local gunsmith.

wirelessguy2005 wrote:i would give the Remington 7 1/2 BR a try. I bet your problems will disappear.

Exactly what I would try. The Rem 7.5 primer should solve your problem, I would almost bet. Bill K

I use WSR primers exclusively. Have never had an issue with hardness of primers. I have used both the silver and the brass colored primers in the same loads, in 223 and 204. I have pushed loads up to max loads, and still never had a problem. H4895 is the only powder that I can get decent accuracy with, when using 40gr. V-Max. The only reason I backed off just a bit bit was because of accuracy issues. You did not mention the temps, when you were shooting. Also, were you keeping ammo out in the sun, on your bench. When I am shooting in warmer temps and out the sun, I keep my ammo in an ice chest, just to avoid heat problems. I will keep 10 or twenty rounds on my bench at a time. even then only when I am under shade.
Also, if your rounds are getting a little hard to chamber, it sounds like you may need to "bump" the shoulder 1 or 2 thousandths. Neck sizing only, should not cause any problems, unless your OAL is over chamber length.

Also, just because you load in the summer, does not necessarily mean that you will not have heat issues, when shooting in the summer. Keep in mind that heat is an enemy in the sport that we all love!

I'm taking all your input folk's and thank you very much,I havent been to gunsmith yet to see if their is an issue with my firing pin,,but what I did try was shooting my full length resized brass handloads same load,just to see if neck sized was not chambering as snug as it should.Guess what shot two rounds off at a skunk the other night and no issues,BUT let a couple of rounds off tonight on a skunk( and wow the second shot flipped that criitter 3 feet in the air,at 30 yards,lol,,),I had a pierced primer,but that's what hanloading is all about,now I get to play and try to figure what's wrong,,MY thought is ,instead of pulling these rounds' and try a cci BR 4 primer,or reducing my load by 0.3gr,What about reducing my col by .003 to see if I can lessen pressure a little ??

I'm taking all your input folk's and thank you very much,I havent been to gunsmith yet to see if their is an issue with my firing pin,,but what I did try was shooting my full length resized brass handloads same load,just to see if neck sized was not chambering as snug as it should.Guess what shot two rounds off at a skunk the other night and no issues,BUT let a couple of rounds off tonight on a skunk( and wow the second shot flipped that criitter 3 feet in the air,at 30 yards,lol,,),I had a pierced primer,but that's what hanloading is all about,now I get to play and try to figure what's wrong,,MY thought is ,instead of pulling these rounds' and try a cci BR 4 primer,or reducing my load by 0.3gr,What about reducing my col by .003 to see if I can lessen pressure a little ??

Some things I would consider are:
1. Does shooting a skunk release his putrid aroma?!
2. Have you calibrated your powder scale?
3. Have you cleaned and/or uniformed your primer pockets?
4. Check the overall CASE length, not the overall carriage length, but the length of the brass.
5. Are you sure your primers are being seated all the way?
6. The firing pin is easy to remove on the Savage rifle. So, learn how to don that and take a peek at it while it's out.
7. You could try a different brand of primer. I've had good luck with Remington 7 1/2 BR primers.
8. If you're worried about pressure, wouldn't reducing your COL increase your pressure? According to the Ideal Gas Law, it would. So, just a word of caution there

Let us know what you find out.

sharptailhunter wrote:Some things I would consider are:
1. Does shooting a skunk release his putrid aroma?!
2. Have you calibrated your powder scale?
3. Have you cleaned and/or uniformed your primer pockets?
4. Check the overall CASE length, not the overall carriage length, but the length of the brass.
5. Are you sure your primers are being seated all the way?
6. The firing pin is easy to remove on the Savage rifle. So, learn how to don that and take a peek at it while it's out.
7. You could try a different brand of primer. I've had good luck with Remington 7 1/2 BR primers.
8. If you're worried about pressure, wouldn't reducing your COL increase your pressure? According to the Ideal Gas Law, it would. So, just a word of caution there

Let us know what you find out.

answers are=
1-it did last night,but the skunk's I shoot are usually in a farmers field,so what's that matter
2-everytime
3-always
4-always
5-yes they are
6-I haven't learnet that yet,hopefully I will see the gunsmith saturday and I will get him to show me.
7-that's what I'm pondering,I have some cci br4 primers and I belive they are a thicker cup by .004
8-I'm not sure about this one,that's why I am asking,I thought I read that the closer you are to the land's the higher the pressure,but that's why I am asking.

You can get as close as you want to the lands and won't see any pressure signs. If however you are jamming a bullet into them you will see pressure spikes.

dozernomore wrote:I thought I read that the closer you are to the land's the higher the pressure,but that's why I am asking.

By seating the bullet deeper you are decreasing the overall cartridge length and the volume of the case. As volume goes down, temperature and pressure go up. The increase in temperature is relatively transient and can be ignored, more or less. By seating the bullet less, or closer to the lands, you decrease the pressure by increasing the case volume. HOWEVER, all that changes once you have the bullet seated shallow enough that it touches the lands upon chambering the cartridge. Some .204 bullets won't even allow for this because by the time your bullet is touching the lands, it's not seated in the case anymore. The reason why I asked about trimming the case is because if the neck grows too much it could pinch the case mouth and the bullet in the chamber thereby greatly increasing the pressure.

well I thought I would seat the bullets .007 deeper to make a col of 2.260 to see if that would help by reducing pressure a bit,but when I heard the powder crunching (compressing )..it just didn't feel right,lol. So I pulled the remaining rounds and did 10 rounds up at 27.0gr of h4895,and will shoot them this weekend and hopefully they still group well and don't pierce primers,if they do I'm gonna try some factory hornady 40gr just to see if it's a firing pin problem..