SmallCaliberCentral

I see Hornady has come up with a bunch of lead free offerings from 17(rimfire) to 223 and including a 20 cal 30 gr ballistic tip which appears to have the same BC as the 32 V-max. Should make the Californians happy.
Here is some info on them
http://www.hornady.com/store/NTX-newammo

I see the 32gr Nosler lead free bullet is available at Cabelas now too.

i would like to give those 30 g a try at benchrest to see how they do. wondering what the filler material is.

Supposed to be copper, tin, tungsten and iron powder according to advertisements. I got two boxes for testing, but so far rain has kept me from the range.

So far haven't had time to work up loads for the Nosler's .224" offering either, initial results with TAC loads hasn't panned out well. These bullets should be more accurate than the Barnes V.G.'s because of the Ballistic Tip, but more testing is needed.

If the Hornady bullets don't produce any significant accuracy gain over the V.G. with Rl-10x then I'll just keep using them. Getting more accuracy than the Barnes, or equaling it, is going to be tough.


Edited for clarity. The Noslers are .224" 35 grainers.

I recently learned my remy loves VG's....they turn up a disturbingly high degree of accuracy in my gun....not to eager to try anything new now.

FireBall, which VG's are you using? So far I haven't tried them as I've stuck with V-max and Noslers. Gary

Gary: I've got a new stash of VG's, in both .224" and .204" if you want to try some in your rifles. Next outing for Skippy, I'm bringing my little .22 K-Hornet single shot loaded up with a fireform load of Lil Gun and the new Barnes .22 cal 30gr Hornet Varmint Grenade. We'll see how Skippy feels about them at a sedate 3,100 fps in the fireform load for walkabouts. Can't wait to try them in fireformed cases, but all 500 cases are already loaded up with Nosler's. The VG's should clock about 3,400+ fps with the increased case capacity. Pretty sweet for the dinky Hornet case eh? I just hope they shoot well. We'll see.......

Haven't tried them in any of my 204's, as when the SBK's and BT's work so well, I'm loathe to change anything.....know what I mean?

Gube: Sorry for the hijack tangent. I'll have to try the new Hornady's myself too. I keep bugging Wifey to bring home some of the new Nosler 35gr .224" BTLF (BT Lead Free), but they seem in very short supply. I hear they work quite well, dunno, haven't tried them either.

Hi Rick, thanks for the info! I'm like you in that if I figure something out that works I really don't want to mess around changing things. My wife says that I should be more open to change...we'll see Gary

The 26 grain barnes version are SUPER accurate in my remington and I have only tried them with benchmark so far. Can hardly wait to see what they will do with 10X!! Secret in my gun was to seat them OUT.....2.350" = tiny groups!

thank you for the info.

Rick,
I foresee a great disappointment in your future! I've used the 30's in my CZ 527 hornet over H110 for 3209FPS av. but I'd rather shoot the 35 V-max anyday. Most shots resulted in quick kills but they just curl up and die, on flips, splats or air time what so ever. Lead free pah!
......................................20-250ai

Tried the new Hornady .204 30 grain NTX (#22000) at the range yesterday. I fired fifteen rounds after sighting in with my 26 grain Barnes Varmint Grenade load using 25.2 grains of RL-10x in Hornady or Winchester cases, Federal 205M primer, 4,085 fps average velocity over 10 shots.

The Hornady offering is a polymer tipped boat tail bullet .742" +/- long, while the Varmint Grenade is .635" +/- long flat base hollow point.

As usual the Barnes shot tight groups measuring between .250" and .320" at exactly the same POI as when it was put away for the winter. Barrel is a Shilen 1:12 twist, 24" Select Match Savage Varmint Contour, on a Savage Precision Target Action, pillar bedded laminated stock, Bushnell 6-24x Elite 4200 scope.

Hornady's 30 grain NTX shot low to the left, and didn't group tighter than 4". Bullets were randomly dispersed with tightest sub group about 2" within that cluster. As I suspected, the 1:12" barrel twist is too slow to stabilize these longer bullets, especially as they are boat tail and polymer tipped, with a longer ogive compared to the Barnes. Even the Barnes bullet is computed to be unstable with a Stability Factor of 0.869 on the JBM Stability Calculator in a 1:12" twist. Hornady's bullet produces a stability factor of 0.686 or even less stable than the Barnes. Ideal S.F. would be anything greater than 1.2, higher is better. Across the gamut of lead free bullets I have found them to require faster twists than standard, with the polymer tipped variety more prone to instability than the hollow points (Nosler and Hornady). That may be why even the Barnes are less accurate at ranges approaching and exceeding 200 yards, as they slow and become unstable. They danced around rats in Oregon last year on long shots, giving me fits.

Calculations show the Hornady becoming marginally stable with a 1:9" twist (1.219 S.F.) and stable with a 1:8.5" twist (1.367 S.F.). Barnes 26 grain V.G. in a 1:8.5" twist produces a S.F. of 1.842, very stable. If you experience unexplained flyers and misses at long range with these bullets, the twist is most likely the culprit.

This was born out during the same range session using Barnes 6mm, 62 grain V.G. in the .243 WSSM. I had a 1:8" twist barrel made that shoots just incredibly small groups. Cranked out ammo on a progressive press with new FL sized brass, Hunter powder and Wolf primers, every shot went within .275". Same with a 1:9" .224 Pac-Nor barrel in .223 and the 50 grain Barnes V.G. So, crank up the twist if you want to use these bullets, and check your favorite leaded bullet using the JBM Stability Calculator before ordering a barrel. http://www.jbmballistics.com/cgi-bin/jbmstab-5.0.cgi