brass problems

[smitty55]

I fl size brass goes in chamber perfect ejects perfect. after theyare fireformed i shoot them some are fine some are super sticky ejecting. the lenght is fine it is the shoulder. i either bump it back with a body die or fl size it. My loads are not hot and using rl10x. I have never had this problem wioth a rifle , it is a factory savage 25, I like fireformed brass and neck sizing . Accuracy is there half inch or less at 100. Any one else with a problem like this with shoulders.

[futuretrades]

I was having the same problem, but with my 20VT. As no one is manufacturing factory brass, I am doing the same as most 20VT owners, Resizing 221 Fireball brass down to 20 cal. But I have never had a problem with 204. None of my 204 brass has ever seen a fl die. When new, I clean up the necks, chamfer inside and outside, clean up flash holes, then neck size in a Lee collet die. After firing, clean up the primer pockets, neck size again in the Lee die, prime and reload.

My loads are not hot and using rl10x

What is your load, as you did not mention in your post? Each and every rifle is its own animal, even same manufacturer and caliber!

[smitty55]

I use winchester brass, cci 450 primers, 25.5 gr RL10X with 32 gr bk, and 26.5 with the 32 v max, and 24.5 with the 39 gr bk. With all loads the first fireing after fl size with sticky ejection i am shooting half inch or smaller at 100. almost all of the brass after that shooting needs shoulder bumped back. I can just keep fl sizing, but i hate to work the brass, my primers look ok, it is a good shooter for sure, and i the fire formed brass shoots better.

[harry]

How far off the riffling are your loads if they are to close you could be getting pressure build up and that could be your problem. Just a thought.

[jo191145]

Another possibility I would pay attention to if it were my rifle. The Sav m-25 might not be the strongest action going. It was originally designed for the 22 Hornet. You could be experiencing action flex upon firing. If the locking lugs are not mated to the receiver adequately that would compound the problem.

How far are you bumping the shoulders back?

[bazz]

i would drop powder charges down a couple of grains and try a few rounds , it sound like over pressure cheers bazz

[Varmitzapper]

I'm having this shoulder problem with brand new Hornady 32gr V-max's
Shoulder seems too tall. the bolt closes tight or not at all
This is in a CZ 527 American with only about 150 rounds through it
I thought it might be a dirty chamber, but after scrubbing it they are
still tight.

Last year I sent a new box back to Hornady for the same issue.
They were great about it and an tech guy called me back.
I explained that I had just did a 1 to1 comparison on the optical comparator at work.
Up against a new Win. case that I just ran through a FL RCBS die, it was clear that the shoulder
was about .010"-.011" taller. They couldn't find any thing wrong when they tested them in their chamber gauge

They sent me two new boxes from a different lot. I had already loaded the Win. brass So I put the replacements on the shelf,
until just now. Well guess what, I found some tight ones. Even after scrubbing the chamber again.

I didn't have any issues with my reloads. I don't think I want to try pushing the shoulder back with loaded rounds.
Any body ever do this?
I guess I could pull the bullets and run the cases through the FL die.

[futuretrades]

I didn't have any issues with my reloads. I don't think I want to try pushing the shoulder back with loaded rounds.
Any body ever do this?

Although I will not recommend you do this, and any reloading manual out there doesn't recommend such a processes, I have done this with some of my 20VT reloads. Done this with both a bump die and after removing the guts from a fl die. It is up to you to use your own judgement. As stated this process is NOT, I say again not recommended!
Also you might just want to scrap your Hornady brass and save yourself the headache. I have never used Hornady brass myself, but I don't hear much good about it.

[Tokimini]

I don't think I want to try pushing the shoulder back with loaded rounds.
Any body ever do this?
I guess I could pull the bullets and run the cases through the FL die.

Running loaded rounds through a die sounds incredibly dangerous. Do yourself a favor and pull the bullets.

[jo191145]

If I'm reading your post correct you have two boxes of hornady factory ammo, 40 pieces. Some fit tight some will not fit at all. 40 rds is not much of a loss IMO but that's just me.
As future trades stated it is possible to bump shoulders on loaded ammo but obviously not recommended. I've done it and still have all my fingers but,,,,,,, You would need a fl bushing die with bushing and deprimer removed. A standard FL die will not work, don't try it.

Interesting you found Win brass .011" shorter in headspace than the hornady. That's exactly the number my win brass from eight years ago is shorter than the Nosler I now use. Obviously this means nothing as the variations in cheaper brass are enormous.
Do you have a short chamber or is the hornady oversized. Really doesn't matter much in the long run to a reloader now does it. Good luck.

[Varmitzapper]

The dim. from bottom of case to theoretical sharp corner "TS" of the 30 deg. shoulder. Measured today on the comparator.
Fired case = 1.5313" new Win. Brass FL resized and fired once.
New case = 1.5434" Hornady 32 gr V-max
Diff. = .0121" is what the new case shoulder is taller than the fired case

Not sure if the photos show it, but there is a difference.
http://mob214.photobucket.com/albums/cc ... 140701.jpg
Sharpie'd up a new case and chambered it and it shows it's tight at the shoulder Scrubbed the chamber before this test.

Option 1 Pull the bullets and FL resize the brass.
Option 2 Rent a chamber reamer and push the chamber deeper. Would have to first check chamber go-no/go gauges.
Option 3 Try and close bolt on new cases and fire form to chamber

Any Ideas?

[jo191145]

Option 3 is your best bet if possible. Keep those lugs well greased.
In all my savage rifles I set head space to a crush fit on virgin brass. This makes using various factory ammo problematic but I seldom buy factory ammo anyway.
They go in tight but extract like butter. The shoulders pull back as the body of the case expands to fill the chamber. Brass lasts forever.
If your In the .011" area of crush that's excessive. Not something I would want to subject my lugs to.

As a reloader I would never consider increasing my head space in a rifle just to fire off some factory ammo.
If I had a couple pcs of unfixed Nosler brass I'd send em to you. Very consistent barely minimum spec brass. If that stuff does,nt chamber then it's the rifle. Hornady on the other hand has had a myriad of problems over the years. Hardened necks that crack, primer pockets excessively tight.
If you really want to get to the bottom of this start with a go gauge.

[Varmitzapper]

Thank you Mr. Jo for the offer of the brass.
Some of the Hornady rounds were a gift the rest was what Hornady sent me to replace the tall shoulders last year.
I have a bunch Winchester brass that worked fine all summer. This was loaded with 39gr Sierra BK's. Super accurate on the chucks down here in south Jersey. I'm up to 43 as of last week. I'm out of BK's right now, I saw Midway just now had them in bulk Qty's. I was going to use the Hornady's in the meantime. I think my plan will be: option 3 first, then option 1 if that doesn't work.
Thanks to everyone for the responses.

[bow shot]

Great intel Jo'.

I PM'd ya..