SmallCaliberCentral

Ok, first post on this forum and need advise. I have the want to get a Ruger 204 rifle and need help in narrowing the field. I have the following on my list.
Savage 12 Varmint LP
Ruger Hawkeye Varmint/Target
Cooper 21 Montana Varminter


Plan on shooting out to 300 yards and want the most accurate rifle I can get. I will be hand loading for this round. Want are your thoughts?

Welcome to the forum. How about stopping by the new member forum and introduce yourself?

Okay, I'm no expert, but do own five 204 rifles and have been shooting them since the round came out.

That said, out of your list, the most accurate rifle out of the box is one I own.....the Cooper M21 Montana. It is easily the most expensive, best put together with the best materials and workmanship of any rifle on your list. Mine shoots in the .2's (sometimes even better) with either the 32gr or 39gr SBK, has accounted for probably a thousand ground squirrels and dozens of rock chucks. You'll also have the best resale if you ever decide to part with it. Side-by-side comparison of all three will show the difference between what I'd call "custom production" rifle, and mass-produced "take your chances" rifles.

Nothing against the other two listed, the Savage would probably be the second most accurate, but also the heaviest and most "clunky" of the lot. I've got Rugers in the safe too, but I'll admit they are not among the most accurate rifles I own, although all my Cooper's will outshoot any of the others in my safe.

My Cooper MTV in the field doing what she does best.....launch ground squirrels quite briskly!



I shoot more critters than targets, but here's a typical target shot a while back during load development to illustrate my point:



Best of luck with your decision and let us know what you finally decide. The opinions are mine, and are worth exactly what you paid for them.

Cooper for sure if you want a classic, out-of-the-box shooter. The M21 in its various stock configurations is a very nice rifle. I also have a few of these, including this Savage http://www.savagearms.com/firearms/model/12BTCSS
They all shoot well and as Rick said, the Savage is a BUFF (according to some) but shoots lights-out.
If you're interested, I'd let the Savage go for a reasonable price.

Thank you both for the very helpful advise… after looking at my options I think I will hold out and go with the Cooper. I've always loved the look of the Montana Varminter and I know it will shoot. I will see if I can try to find a used one on some of the selling sites if not guess I will place my order and wait the 6 to 9 months. Any thoughts as to 24 vs 26 inch barrel length?

triggerfingers wrote:Any thoughts as to 24 vs 26 inch barrel length?

I don't think you'll ever regret your rifle choice.....I know I have no regrets in that regard.

As for barrel length, there's two factors here....practical/performance and what I'd call personal.

Practical/Performance: Just how much more velocity will that extra 2" of barrel get you? Will you or the target notice the velocity difference? Do you really need that extra two inches to get that wee bit of velocity increase? How important is that extra 50 fps or so?

Personal: To me, that means both how the rifle looks (aesthetics) how it carries and balances both in your hands and on the bench.

All my varmint rifles wear 24" barrels. That gives me a rifle that carries well and is not grossly muzzle heavy. It gives me all the velocity I think I need, and it also gives the rifle a balanced appearance and not "barrel long" to the eye. Purely subjective, but you asked. My Cooper 204R MTV came to me wearing a 26" barrel, even though Cooper's advertising/specifications showed it to be 24". I sent it back to the factory to have the barrel cut back to 24" and have not regretted it one bit. The rifle now carries well, is not way too muzzle heavy, and just plain looks better (to me).

Speaking of velocity, as my MTV launches the 32gr bullets at over 4,000 fps, and the 39/40 's at over 3,800 fps, I didn't feel the extra barrel length did anything for me except to make my rifle too heavy, too long, and handle like crap both in the hands and on the bench. Again, purely subjective.

In the end, the choice is up to you. None of the rock chucks, ground squirrels and badgers shot with my Cooper MTV 204 have had any complaints as to lacking velocity after being smacked, except for actually being smacked. And I have a rifle that I'm completely happy with in all regards....looks good and handles great. JMO JME

Now you would have to pay a lot of money to get the advice Rick gives out so freely. I don't own a Cooper, but after listening to that explanation, I want one. With the 24" barrel! I have a Remington XR-100, but alas, they might be hard to get hold of.

Agree with the 24" barrel recommendation. I have a couple of 26" Coopers and they are indeed front heavy. When the barrels go, I'll replace with 24".
Everything I've read and experienced is that longer does not = more accurate, just a little more velocity. I'd rather hit my target slowly than miss it real fast.
I did make a decision when I re-barreled a 243AI to leave the barrel at 261/4". This is a drag around the dirt gun for antelope and whitetails. My thinking was when (not if) I bugger up the crown, I've got plenty to chop off and re-crown. It's now just a PITA to get in and out of a truck with the thing.

Thanks again for the free advise... really do appreciate it. The reason I was asking about the extra 2" was for maybe that little extra in accuracy. But that may not be the case.

After doing some searching for a used Cooper MTV and not being able to come up with anything, I went to my local dealer and placed the order for a new one. Now the hardest part, the wait!

Good choice; hope the wait's not very long! I have three .204s, including a "Sunday-go-to-meetin'" Cooper. It has a 26 inch barrel but doesn't seem to be as front-heavy as some other rifles with that length I've handled. I enjoy the extra fps for our big Eastern woodchucks at a few more yards than my 24 and 22-inchers, but totally understand why the 24 works as a good compromise. I do wish Cooper and others would go to a 1:11" barrel twist rate to stabilize the 40-grain bullets better; mine does fine with 39 Sierra Blitzkings, though.

triggerfingeers wrote: ↑Fri May 12, 2017 7:03 pm After doing some searching for a used Cooper MTV and not being able to come up with anything, I went to my local dealer and placed the order for a new one. Now the hardest part, the wait!

Congrats, do you have any good pics? I'd like to get this rifle soon.

I'm still waiting for the rifle to be built... it's only been about three months since I ordered it.

triggerfingers wrote: ↑Wed Aug 23, 2017 4:39 am I'm still waiting for the rifle to be built... it's only been about three months since I ordered it.

FYI: First Stop Guns (SD) is showing a couple .204s in stock; one is an M51 repeater for not much more than the "single-shots" are going for many places.

Just got word from Cooper that my MTV Mod 21 in 204 Ruger has shipped should be here in about a week.

Congrats mine will show up tomm at my ffl. Mtv in .204. Still scope shopping but i think a leupold 6.5 x 20 x 40 w side focus. And maybe the cds dials. Im looking for suggestions for a hard case to transport in