Accuracy issues with Savage Model 10/110 Predator

[Avagadro]

Supposedly, Savage replaced the barrel. You couldn't convince me from the first cleaning that I did when I received the "repaired" rifle. I spent a couple of days off and on cleaning it. It was NOT pretty. I used all MPRO products for the cleaning, including the copper. I can not see anything that looks like copper in the barrel and the patches are now (finally) coming out clean. The copper took the longest time to remove. I have not had it back to the range yet. It is pretty darn cold around here right now. I may try the indoor (still cold) range later today to see what happens. Either way, I will keep everyone posted with anything that looks like progress!

So here is a question for you guys - how do you know when your gun is really clean and is there a possibility of being "too clean?" I have been told NOT to over-clean guns by some folks and I have been told to clean my guns after 10-15 rounds. What makes the most sense for a 204 prairie dog gun?

Thanks to all!

Avagadro

[futuretrades]

My cleaning preference is, Shooters choice/ Kroil in a 70% S C, 30% Kroil mix, for carbon/powder fouling with a brass brush. For copper fouling, I use CR10 with a nylon brush. I have tried Wipe Out, used in conjunction with the Accelerator. In my experience, used as directed by the manufacture, after a day shooting skippy, and cleaning for 2 or 3 days, even scrubbing with a nylon brush, patches began coming out fairly clean. I did an experiment afterwords, using my regular regimin, i.e SC/Kroil mix, with no signs of carbon/powder fouling. Then I used my trusted CR10, as per above. I was getting blue on the patches! Copper still in the barrel!
Also did the reverse test, regular regimine. Then a couple patches with alcohol, to get any residue out of the barrel. Then I started with Patch Out, as per directions. I had absolutely no signs of copper or carbon/powder fouling. I will continue using my preferred cleaning methods, and maybe use wipe out in the field, for a quick, but not in my own mind, a thorough cleaning.
JME

[cshooter]

I've had a Savage Predator in 204 for about 3 years now. I couldn't get mine to print anything 39gr and heavier better that 3/4 to 1 " at 100 yrds, BUT, when I backed down to the 39 gr Sierra BK, 37 gr CRT, 35 gr Berger bullets, things really changed ! My groups now average 1/2 to 1" at 200 yrds. I kill mostly coyotes out at my farm because I have cattle, and I rarely shoot past 250 yards, but it did show a favoritism to mid-range weight bullets in 20 cal. Try 25 gr of RE-10x in Winchester, Remington, or Nosler cases and I bet you'll get that gun to shoot. You may or may not get tiny groups, but accuracy is a state of mind sometimes. Just a thought.

[cshooter]

P.S I use a foaming bore scrubber every 15 to 20 rnds and have no fouling issues messing up my hunting. Also when I bought the rifle all I did was for the first 10 rounds, I cleaned it every shot with Barns CR-10, then the same thing every 5 rnds for the next 20 rnds, then twice after the next two 10 rnd strings. After that I clean it every 20 rnds. That's my barrel break-in. I've got around 2300 rounds through that rifle now and she still shoots the same. My 2 cents.

[Avagadro]

Thanks CSshooter! I am excited about the 39gr BK. I loaded some of those last night and will be headed to the range soon. I also loaded some 32 gr BKs. I tried both set ups with H335 and Benchmark. These were the only powders that were really available at the time I purchased them. I just received my RCBS reloader and am getting familiar with it. I have a number of powders, loads and bullets in the fray and hope to have some results as soon as I can get to the range. I will keep you posted - I am certainly looking forward to a < 0.5 MOA rifle. The savage did meet that requirement at one time, but has since lost it. As I mentioned, I was able to take out MINI clay targets (about 2.4 inches at 320 yards ) with NO problems. Now, the gun wont hit the a$$ end of an elephant next door. I hope the 39gr BK is the ticket but if not, I am a persistent guy. Thanks also for your cleaning regiment!!

Best Regards,

Russ

[JustClint]

Their is a similar type of experience posted on another forum in which the gun is a 17 Remington, shot good then started shooting horrible and key holing, turned out it was copper fouling that his cleaning regimen was missing. I've used Sweets,Butch's bore shine, and Wipeout with great results on all my guns but I clean every time I get done shooting. One thing to try if you think it's a cleaning issue is run som JB bore paste down it, clean that gunk out and then clean your usual method. Just a suggestion, I could be way off as I'm no expert

[Avagadro]

Thanks Just Clint! That is good to know. It is certainly possible that I did not maximize my cleaning regimen. I have been using the MPRO7 suite. I finally got my first reloading hardware set up. I have reloaded several hundred thousand shotgun rounds, but I am VERY new to Metallic reloading. I reloaded some 204s today and took them to the range. Using a variety of Benchmark and H335 along with SBK 32s and 39s and was able to get some very good results - something on the order of about 0.3-0.4 MOA and that was without any tweaking, so I hope that I am on to something that might get the gun back in business. Either way, I am learning a ton and hope to get this gun back on track. I have used the JB paste - it is great and I use it on my air rifle also. Awesome stuff. I need to get some sweets, wipe out and butches bore shine. It certainly can not hurt. The difference between the Hornady 40 gr factory ammo compared with the simple reloads that I put together are OFF THE CHARTS - at least for my rifle. I am excited to restart the next reloading batch to see what I can come up with using the 32 SBK and the 39 SBK. I am looking for some Bergers but they seem to be out of stock just about everywhere. I would also like to get some other powders but many of them are back-ordered, sold out, etc. Thanks to all of the thoughts from everyone. I appreciate it. I will send out some before and after target pix soon. This game is very different from sporting clays!!! Thanks, Avagadro

[JustClint]

You'll love the metallic reloading process, it'll be a new addiction. I've had everything I needed to reload twice in my life and both times had to sell it all off so I'm stuck with factory ammo again.

[Jim White]

Don't forget about "Carbon" fouling. Just wanted to add that thought because it seems so much is talked about copper fouling, but carbon fouling will give bad accuracy too.

Just sayin'

[JustClint]

Don't forget about "Carbon" fouling. Just wanted to add that thought because it seems so much is talked about copper fouling, but carbon fouling will give bad accuracy too.

Just sayin'

I don't know if I ever had a problem with it but I kept a bottle of GM TOP ENGINE CLEANER around after reading about that a few years back, good point!!