Breaking in a Barrel???

[Bayou City Boy]

Does this window cleaner contain ammonia?

Yes, Windex does or did contain ammonia. Glass Plus does not and is clearly labeled as ammonia free. I learned this by cleaning my glasses with Windex, only to find it stripped anti-glare coating off the lenses due to the ammonia. My optician scolded me!

I use a squirt of carburetor cleaner, it strips oil based lubes and even some carbon. Patches squeak going down the bore it gets so clean.

Then some recommend using a break in fluid, Pac_Nor recommends Holland's Witch's Brew, and Greg Tannel supplies Grafoil.

Maybe I'm wrong, but we seem to be getting cleaning and break-in sort of jumbled together here... cleaning is a part of breaking in a barrel but they are not synonomous.

Chris At PacNor recommends Holland's Break-in Oil, and not Witches Brew Barrel Cleaner for a barrel conditioner. Greg T's Grafoil is just a form of colloidal graphite to condition a barrel for a first shot or two.

Incidently, breaking in a barrel does not necessarily make a barrel shoot better accuracy-wise. It's long been argued that it improved copper fouling, but in essence a bad barrel that copper fouls is going to continue to foul and an inaccurate barrel will never be accurate....No matter how you deal with them when new...

If you took two barrels and "broke one in" per someone's directions and you just cleaned and shot the other one, if you use a bore conditioner for the first few shots down both barrels you'll probably see little if any difference in the two factory barrels.

Never shooting a dry barrel is the key to how easy a barrel cleans up, and its not important if a strict "break-in" routine was used or not. Like Gale McMillan has been quoted many times as saying, a strict and strenuous break-in routine is a good ways to sell more barrels, and little else.

Use a bore conditioner for the first shot in a clean barrel and a lot of problems never happen that some folks feel should and will happen if you don't break in a barrel.

Try some colloidal graphite in a clean barrel and save a lot of dollars in break-in ammo costs, and you also save barrel life and still get the same copper fouling results in the end with a factory barrel. With a custom barrel that is hand lapped (and in essence "broken-in" by hand lapping), using a bore conditioner is still a must if you want to keep a barrel shooting well over a longer period of time.

JMO - BCB

[Varmintcaller]

Jim White

The Windex that I use does NOT contain ammonia. At least its not listed on the label

[Clover_Shooter]

BCB,
Thanks for the colloidal graphite info.

Would this be the as WS2 and Denatured Alcohol mixture (that I have been using)!

[Bayou City Boy]

BCB,
Thanks for the colloidal graphite info.

Would this be the as WS2 and isopropyl alcohol mixture (that I have been using)!

Clover_Shooter:

The approach is somewhat the same in that both are lubricants. However, WS2 (or Danzak) is tungsten disulfide whereas colloidal graphite is nothing but pure sub-micron sized graphite mixed with an evaporative solution. Lock-Eze is a common example of a colloidal graphite solution.

I use colloidal graphite as a last step in barrel cleaning before I put a rifle away or shoot it again. The colloidal graphite actually dries and becomes a sub-micron thin coating in the pores of the barrel. It also helps to preserve the barrel steel as it is also an anti-corrosive solution "painted' in the barrel. In contrast, WS2 and similar lubricants like moly are typically used to coat the bullets. One problem with moly and with WS2 is the fact that it can cause corrosion in barrels when free sulfides are mixed with moisture.

Are you coating the bullets or the barrel with your mixture?

I picked up the colloidal graphite idea many years ago when I was involved in BR shooting while living out in West Texas. It was originally used by BR shooters to keep several fouling shots closer to the actual competitive group in point of impact. One side effect was it reduced copper fouling in barrels. I've used it on a barrel ever since as a part of my cleaning routine. I just run a CG saturated patch down a clean dry barrel and let the rifle set muzzle down for 15-20 minutes for the liquid carrier to evaporate. Then I run a loose clean dry patch down the barrel to clean up any excess, and I'm done.

I've shot a lot of 17 and 20 caliber rifles over the years, and I have never used coated bullets. The colloidal graphite has worked well for me.

HTH - BCB

[Clover_Shooter]

I have been using WS2 on almost all bullets. I also coat "paint" the barrel much the same as you do. I did not know WS2 was corrosive!

[Bayou City Boy]

I have been using WS2 on almost all bullets. I also coat "paint" the barrel much the same as you do. I did not know WS2 was corrosive!

Not everyone who uses moly or Ws2 has corrosion problems, but in wet environments, since both materials contain sulfur, free sulfur can mix with water and the result can be sulfuric acid in varying concentrations. If the concentratino is strong enough or if it is left unatended for too long, corrosion can ocur. Moly shooters in some cases started seeing corrosion under the moly coating in barrels if left for too long of a time after shooting sessions.

I wasn't saying that their use WILL cause corrosion, but it CAN if the issue is not understood and dealt with by proper cleaning...

-BCB

[jo191145]

Home Depot now sells colloidial graphite in a spray can thats very similar to Lock Ease which can be hard to find in stores. Its called "Graphite Extreme" and in the HD near me was located next to the key duplicating machine.

For breaking in a factory rifle barrel I've used Lock Ease in a saturation method. Clean that new barrel down to bare steel. A little alcohol or similar fast drying solvent to remove all oil's and cleaning solvents from the barrel. With the muzzle pointed down spray the graphite into the bore until it liberally runs out the muzzle.
Both Lock Ease and Graphite Extreme come with a thin nozzle tube to get into key holes. This of course helps get past the chamber and into the bore. If your using Graphite Extreme simply allow the bore to dry.
Swab the bore two or three times using the same patch if your using Lock Ease.
Swab the chamber with alcohol to remove the graphite.
Go shoot your gun. No cleaning regimen required.
If after twenty rds your seeing copper in the muzzle (very unlikely) Then clean thoroughly and repeat.
If no copper is visible clean normally and continue firing without the graphite application. Check for copper frequently using a mini mag light.
This saturation method actually works for barrel break in.

After the first twenty rds with no cleaning your barrel is essentially broke in. Along the lines of what BCB said thats as good as its gonna get. Anything past that point is going to be barrel wear. Barrel wear can help avoid coppering but theres no reason to fight your way there with solvents,brushes and wasted ammo.

On side by side tests between the two products on the bottom of a stainless action I consider Graphite Extreme the clear winner. It dries almost on contact. Much faster than Lockease and leaves an even coating of graphite that adheres to the steel. It cannot be rubbed off with a finger and is resistant to oils. Alcohol or bore solvent will quickly remove it though.
My can of Lock ease did not dry on the steel after five minutes and could be wiped off. Hence my two different bore prep suggestions.

I haven't tried GE as a bore seasoner yet so I'll offer no opinions on that. Its rapid drying might make patch application more difficult.

Contrary to Howas suggestion I would not fire a dry bore. Wether oil,graphite or WS2,moly,hbn something needs to ease that first shot down the tube. JMO.

[Clover_Shooter]

I have some Microfyne Graphite- Extra-fine (-325 mesh) graphite.
I use this in dry form on triggers and such, can I make my own "homebrew" colloidal graphite! Or might I run into issues with WS2 & graphite!

[jo191145]

Clover

Yes I'm sure you could whip up your own graphite mixture. Lighter fluid might be the best all around carrier as the slight amount of oil will make it stick to parts. Alcohol would be my other choice.

JMO but if your shooting WS2 bullets why not just stick with the WS2 as a bore prep.
WS2 also works great dry on triggers and as a bolt lube for the interior of your bolt. No messy oils inside the bolt to attract dirt or gum up in cold weather.

I even used it on the exterior of my bolt, bolt lugs and raceways once. Really slicks up an action but its not pretty Makes your bolt look filthy.

[Bayou City Boy]

I have some Microfyne Graphite- Extra-fine (-325 mesh) graphite.
I use this in dry form on triggers and such, can I make my own "homebrew" colloidal graphite! Or might I run into issues with WS2 & graphite!

I have no idea if the two would cause a conflict if used together. I've never been a "bullet coater", so I know next to nothing about how they might react.

LOL....! I guess this is why we have horse races. I've used the aerosol Graphite Extreme and I do not like spraying liquids around a rifle action. Maybe just old fashioned on my part, but I like applying Lock-Eze to a patch from a squeeze bottle while using a good bore guide and running the patch down the barrel... It does dry slower, but a bore scope shows that you can get an nice even layer of graphite in a barrel using Lock-Eze on a patch that stays in place for the first few shots down a barrel. Then most of it is gone and, as already stated, it can be easily removed from a barrel with a solvent if you want it out for some reason.

I have never had trouble finding Lock-Eze and have used it for years. And as I stated earlier, I use it as a last step to barrel cleaning on all my rifles and for me it is not just a barrel break-in thing. I use it any time a barrel is cleaned for the life of the barrel.

JMO - BCB

[Wrangler John]

Bayou City Boy is correct. There are two Witches Brew products currently sold by Holland's Shooter's Supply; Witches Brew Break-in Fluid and Witches Brew Copper Remover. I have been using an older product Witches Brew Bore Lube, this may not be available now, or may just be repackaged. It isn't really a concern I need to check out.

Break-in and cleaning have a correspondence in that avoiding heavy fouling is somewhat desirable if for no other reason than the convenience of cleaning. It is said that a barrel is considered to be broken in when the level of fouling drops off. I do not shoot factory barrels, simply because there isn't anything offered by the factories that I want or need, so my experience is limited to custom barrels. In every case these foul minimally and usually stabilize within the first few rounds, cleaning up with only a wet and dry patches.

Indeed, Shilen states that they have a break-in procedure because everyone thinks they should!

It can not be proven whether or not a given barrel improves with or without a break-in procedure, because once it is processed with one technique it can't be retested with the other. Testing two similar barrels is not a true measure because the performance difference can be attributed to normal variations between samples due to other factors.

Having a new rifle is wonderful, it's up to you how to break it in, if at all.